PoP 116 | The Psychology of Design and Private Practice an interview with Wilfred Krenn


In this podcast session, I talk about the psychology of design, images, growing a private practice, and picking a niche market with Wilfred J. Krenn.

PoP Culture meet Wilfred J. Krenn

wilfredWilfred is a Licensed Professional Counselor in Private Practice working with gifted children in the Saint Louis area. He has extensive training in the effects of trauma and the impact of stress on neurobiology, as well as traditional psychotherapeutic technique. After spending over 10 years in the Non-Profit world Wilfred brings his expertise to the larger community. One of his passions is working with intelligent and creative patients, giving them a platform to explore what is getting in the way of their success.

He’s also the man behind Psychology of Design, design to help therapists.


Resources from Past Podcasts

Get the a PDF of the 10 Tips for Starting a Part-Time Private Practice

Join my webinar about how to start a part-time private practice.

Meet Joe Sanok

consultant headshot JoeJoe Sanok, MA, LLP, LPC, NCC is one of the world’s leading private practice consultants. He is the owner of the Traverse City counseling practice, Mental Wellness Counseling. Joe helps counselors to start private practices and grow them.



Podcast Transcription

Pop 116 | The Psychology Of Design And Private Practice An Interview With Wilfred Krenn

Joseph R. Sanok: Counselor, Private Practice Owner, Marketing Expert, And Consultant
The Practice of the Practice Podcast: Small Business Growth | Marketing | Blogging | Small Business

[0:00] Music.

[0:27] Welcome to the practice and the practice podcast and do some actor host i am so glad you letting me into yours,
into your brain and your day is going really really well we’re live from practice of the practice headquarters in the radio center to building in downtown traverse city.
The epicenter of awesome culture so i’m really glad you’re here.
Hey i want to tell you if you didn’t follow it fell about it from my email list or see it on facebook.
I am launching my very first wedding r it’s gonna be on wednesday february seventeenth.
That’s gonna be at two o’clock eastern that’s one o’clock now we did the wrong and the page two o’clock eastern.
One o’clock central twelve pm.
Mt ten and eleven pacific i got a switch that around the goes out suppose to but anyway way it’s two o’clock eastern.
On the seventeenth of february it’s can be really awesome so i found this platform called zoom dot us and,
each person if they want they get a like a live.
Video feed for themselves and so we can see each other we can you can reach your hand you can so with second and then,
i have a question and then it goes to your web cam and that’s really great because it feels like we’re all in the same room and i’m gonna be talking for part of it to them and f ck you in a for part of it and so i really want to be one of these things that.

[1:57] It feels like we’re all hanging out together and so view over to practiceofthepractice.com/webinar,
it’s totally free the way for me to give back and specifically gonna be around starting growing a part-time private practice so for a lot of you just this stuff how do i start how we going like,
i don’t have a full-time job and i want to do is on the side of me leave my full-time job don’t test it out how do you do that,
yes that’s exactly what i did for you from two thousand nine to two thousand fourteen as growing a part-time business until in two thousand thirteen,
it was making as much as my full-time job in two thousand fourteen made more than my full-time job and into the early two thousand fifteen,
i left my full-time job summary talking about the three more most important steps to rocking a private practice,
i’m gonna talk with you other things like how to easily take a few hours we can create income rest talk about how all the steps in the best ways to,
to just grow and so on there’s only fifty spots andrea little different than most loving is most weapon as the way that you do it.
Is people will all registry my two hundred or three hundred registrants and then maybe fifty or sixty people show up.
And the people that didn’t show up on other figure replay if i’m gonna be something else like i can go to.
I am not going to be doing a replay images when i again but the way it’s gonna work is this fifty spots in so by registering,
all you’re getting is the link to be able to get on that day and so the first fifty people that get into that meeting of the people to get to be there and so it’s or gonna be one of those like.

[3:34] The most motivated most people that take the time to have it together that there gonna be there.
Ready to go and i may have to do another wedding in the future i may be more but right now i’m just kinda testing it out,
and already have ninety eight people that have signed up so already that’s me people alone to get in.
Which of these kind of a fun dynamic to have us some point change that up.
Play now can it feels like it be it be fun to have a line waiting at the door of hope some the leaves so i can pop into that women are.
So yes head over to practiceofthepractcie.com for such web and are really excited for this hoping that were gonna have a lot of really getting gauge met.
So today all my gosh this guy wilfred crab and he is amazing.
He did consulting with me a while back i six months ago or so and oftentimes when i do consulting people.
Their website is one of the very first things that i start to say hey we had to make some changes here like what what’s going on with this website.
But with will for this website right away i could tell like he had an eye for our in i for design and i for creativity.
And he didn’t need any help from the website and it’s so refreshing to see a counselor it really puts on the tenth of only.
To check out his website i’m heading over to psychology of design dot co which is a cat aimed at people like you and me their own practices like of the basics design he’s got some giveaways there he’s gonna give away.

[5:09] In the show all seven insurance but,
wilfred is just me and his such a good eye for design today show he’s gonna talking about how did he get into his niche market of helping gifted children and creative professionals is gonna talk about some of the best practices around design.
How to use candles how to use a number of different tools that are out there,
things are just really important help you stand out very competitive markets the time so without any further ado i give you the one the only the never replicated wilfred j cram.
Well freud cran welcome to the practice the practice podcast.
The jealous thing so much for having me yeah this is awesome we’ve been working together in a consulting relationship to just chat about your practice and can we are headed what you’ve been doing and so excited to have you on the show today,
sober people don’t know you maybe just tell us a little bit about your st louis practice and we can talk a little bit about can the branding and marketing and all that is well so tell me about your practice.

[6:14] Sure so i’m dying it back see in see louis missouri i’ve been in.
Is there a practice in march of this year so.
Just a test about nine months now so it’s been a really great learning experience i came out of working your agency non-profit in.
And so transit making that transition and then in a building going practice and.
You know deciding why.
I wanted to focus to be and in what i was loquacious just been really interesting.
The process is an opportunity i always forget that your practice is that young because like your was so good and you just like doing such a great job with kind of focusing in and gifted children and their families and,
like i just forget that it’s like that young you just seem like you have a practice for a long time.

[7:22] Yeah i do too many things for you know for sure and some of us in private practice is always been the goal so.
A lot of these things are things that i’ve been thinking about for three years and just having the opportunity now to put them in place is is is really great.
Yeah so so fifty one percent of my audience either is thinking about starting practice soon or just started a private,
this and so i just survey and so i know there’s a lot of people that are in that building phase maybe like a year ago or two years ago you were thinking about it,
what were some tools or tips or things the un recommend for them they’re like the very beginning stages of launching practice sure.
So i mean maybe a back up a little bit in this business is i think this is something that’s.
Important in the working and agency non-profit.
Counseling or therapy which i do a lot of people and chewing right out of grad school and is really challenging it is one of those things where in the.

[8:34] The work is just constant and a lot of times your dealing with really significant trauma and really challenging she says and does is the expectation that starts of the working and in.
To the train and entered the back to and it’s not doing so.
You’re a newer completely burned out and you know can he can take one more step or be in.
When just i the only other option is is to get out and try something new maybe not even in counseling at all and you begin to realize.
How much that makes noise from back in an hour.

[9:24] When was it and i think the possibility is.
No creativity that i’ve always the unit has a part of myself just really exploded and
that’s the great thing about having a practice working for yourself is the using do you,
what everyone there’s nobody there to saying this is the population we work with or these are these are the procedures and policies that we have you can you to create those switches,
you know for me most probably welsh path from the and so i think that the baby things to to start out with at least for for myself why is.

[10:15] My office on a website and.
No for from me and this probably has a little bit to do about how i work i come out of some of the psychoanalytic psycho dana make.
Was reading a lot about process and you even by the way that.
The room is in terms of the battery relationships ohio is seen my office as sort of an extension of myself,
so in terms of setting it up in a way that i.
No not only facility and in really great there conditioner action but also reflected.
Why would a practice to be was really important to me so i spent a lot of time in you know that in mind before it really opening it opening just getting it getting things.
It is title good about you i wanted,
when i am starting from the office ceiling of this is this is my place this is a place where,
i can do my password at that so network and i remember when we upgraded just over a year ago to a for office suite down hunch ever city.
And we have been sub leasing from someone that furnished and it just like it wasn’t my office at all it was ceo of a right of the couch and then when you starting at sometimes you have to do that,
holy cow like that process of were moving into a new office i made up interest for that was decorations or after a call that was like.

[11:52] The cord for a private practice or something like that i would just like take pictures of all these ideas and be an ikea and all these other places that i wanted to have a certain feel to the practice and.
I think you’re right when you walk into your practice to like this is miley can’t believe i could show up to work here that gives a different energy into your sessions then if you like.
Oh i’m in this like i literally had a non-profit basement light counseling office where like smelled like more it’s like i know i’m previous pastor please know i am like,
i would bring you just feel it more and they we’re in there trying to say let let’s talk about better in your life just has a little different feel,
then when you are able to say okay this is my office this is almost an extension of the counseling i love that you bring that up as part of the process of building a practice.

[12:43] You know i think your for leaving you can you mention this a lot of people in there sir whether it’s you know just,
hard times i practiced outside of the four hundred of that they’re doing their part-time job that they’re doing and your sub letting from somebody that can be hard you know not feeling like,
the spaces and hopefully you’ve huge you found something that you feel comfortable in to having just like one thing even if it’s something that you bring in everyday because the person who way you change anything just one thing that you can bring in,
to make it to.
Buy your space i think makes a wifi huge difference me my very first place that i worked at,
i was so low on the totem pole like i didn’t even get a consistent office i would show up and say whose office is free,
and so the thing that i did at the beginning of every session either like you got the clients in the waiting room they have like fifteen offices,
i say the tour of the offices continues and it was like our joke every time they like what this is going to be like in,
it became the joker also became like okay counseling is more about our relationship than like the physical space but now that i get,
i also understand the other side where your physical space like definitely can enhance your therapy and it’s about consistency up,
people who come to the notice and i’ve had a conference room so bloated from people and,
they start to make assumptions and guesses into who you are by the way you have in your office so.

[14:22] Wonderful amazing he’s a psychologist when her when her patients with a new this,
pictures but you have in your office you know,
i’m in means a lot to me really feel like that’s part of the connection we have and she does well that’s not really in my pc is a bad,
that’s funny busy office environment really important and then you set your website was really important and it’s funny cuz we first or consulting like one of the first things i usually do the website review,
and will be with you my website review is pretty much it’s awesome here’s a couple of weeks have been so sick talk about for one how did you figure out how to do websites yourself,
and then to like what are some tips that we can just give to people that are starting a private practice around the website sure i think fur from.

[15:20] Like most people i am you kind of start out with the old and in knowing quite sure.
Where to start so that the web site builders like wax and square space are,
are really and attractive and really fantastic and nice actually started out with a guy a break say and i and i liked it because it gave me you sort of.
Complete control over what that looks like a day and time but some things pay you and you can,
basically start for with a blank canvas and a horse races a little bit more difficult to should,
do you know if you if that’s what you’re looking for there at a.
I like having a blank canvas to say you know this is this is what i went to project.
To my a.

[16:22] Patience is one project to you know the people that that i’m marketing to and be able to see that.
You over that over the course,
of this year because the thing about me is that when i have no idea if i have the means to make it happen all to a is true you eleven years old i.
Yeah i really i really three websites out there at the moment just because you know at it i think it’s.
If it is about how you how you thinking i’m always seen myself as more of a contractual think or where if i have any idea into.
Coming up with.
Everything around that is really important to the kind of support and you know the whole picture so i could i do have try though.

[17:22] Wish some of us could square space and the way it eventually ended up with and this is this maybe something for people who are interested in this is.

[17:37] Through adobe creative cloud adobe is the wind makes photoshop and illustrator and stay in the also a website builder which,
it’s basically that plane candice you know you can,
buildings pictures and graphics in photoshop and then transfer them into this website builder so you have to complete control.
Buy just like anything do you know there’s and it also means you’re the one doing all that so it everywhere on design skills students exactly learning and learning coding and,
how to set a web forums and blogs and all that stuff will fit for you if your people know where to pay,
a practice that are launching website like who would you say would be a good fit for when,
for square space would be a good fit for like wordpress who would you direct towards each of those.

[18:38] Sure i think i think it depends on in.
A lot depends on your style and a lot of it depends on how much time and work you wanna spend,
doing it i think for people who are in a meeting for like a minor and simple website heating square space is fantastic.
Can you play the me you think you’re in your pictures and it’s basically all set up for you,
which is really great and it looks and works really breaking it when you think about certain that modern graphic web site a.
Where you have,
baby images and it’s because just cause you and i think square space is a really good job of that anything in addition to that i have i have heard that they do a really great job with,
no can you set up with those shit as ceo points that,
you really need to get noticed and then or for people who you know what a little more control and have the time to and with our answer to really put something into it i think it increases his,
that’s pretty good i don’t think it’s as good in terms of.
You know as ceo and things like that a square space and of course not as good as.

[20:07] WordPress right but if you’re looking for something that’s.
Pretty expensive and use you can do a lot of creative control i think you can be a good option for people.
So like i know that people like you and i that like are we like design like we have more of a design i,
hello that comes really easy to us like well yeah of course i’m gonna like do things this way i’m gonna have images look like this week when would you recommend that people just like outsource,
all of their website where designer branding when you got really into the bringing side of it which one adult sure i pick your brain and but like websites in particular like when,
when you just say you know what like this isn’t my forte like i need to outsource this.

[20:54] I need to find a new in number one weather you like it or no if that’s something that is interesting to you and.

[21:04] No you wanna have yourself reflected in those things in.

[21:12] Seven just like your an artist or painter anything graphic design and web design of functions,
align the same way so if you have bad by lying and that’s something that’s getting really important.
Doing during these things during design and doing but is for me it’s kinda part of my self-care yeah i know it’s where is the key to express my creativity.
Yeah i totally lying getting lost in to some artistic project or the graphic or like i agree like for me that’s it doesn’t ever feel like work to me and so the idea of outsourcing because i can my wife christina,
and she’s like we’ll why would you outsource that like you know that it’s not gonna be as good as you want it to be and what you gonna i spend so much time critiquing in you just love doing absolutely yeah i don’t have to outsource that,
yes yeah that’s great you know.
Forester mean is if i had someone to stealing and i won’t ever.
If they don’t have the times really get to know me and what i wanted and it kind of white.

[22:26] Yo and personality into that my practice has i would be really,
kind of buying this is not exactly right and not exactly seeing things the way i see things so when you’re if you’re looking for something like that you really wanna make sure you find somebody to,
is it going to take time to really get to know you as a practitioner,
and as a person and go to have your style and your nude and especially to your marketing with because all those things make a big difference in,
terms of what is eventually look like for why i love your point of if you like it then yes try for a while and if you don’t like it don’t do it,
i got so cheating in lots of areas where in we run a private practice are launching line,
we feel like we need to every single thing especially don’t have a lot of money coming in you know you probably should you allow yourself just so you not going to death for some it’s supposed to help your family and help you.
I’m great when i think about disability social media i all talk to people and they’re like well i guess i should be on twitter and i should be on this and that and what would you like twitter heated think don’t be on it like you’re gonna be bad at it,
and just on the things you like it really investing that or i’m just talking to someone yesterday and she is leaking are probably should launch a podcast for what i wanna do.
And she’s like i don’t wanna keep up with it.
And i was able to make a deal thirty a podcast like thirty walk through are you know a video blog or just write early.

[23:59] You can always invest in things you like and if you put tons of time into that you’re gonna make so much more content than the average person is spreading himself over a bunch of different platforms.

[24:10] Hhm that’s right and we talked about this earlier by signing this is your practice.
You mean there’s more there’s a whole lot of information out there in terms of you know these are the things that really can for one or.
This is where everybody else’s during buy it this is this is your opportunity to do the things that you really like.
You wanna do so if there’s something that attracts you more than the other things you do that that’s what you’re successful.

[24:46] Well and where just talking before you jumped and how you were you when the chess club this morning toilet plunger up at like loaded into the brain stuff but i love like your level of self-care and commitment to things outside your practice.

[25:01] Yeah so and this kind of fits in with you know in terms in terms of practice my main focus is on and just in children and so.
I have a number trinity of the to do something things that not only,
no get me in touch with some places where i need.
In perspective questions but also things that i really enjoy that kind of like the perfect the perfect match so just come actually made a to sunday for kids to.
I’m doing to me and with me and.

[25:44] This is a really great opportunity to spend time with them and.

[25:51] It’ll j can get me an interact with people that you know could.
This may not necessarily be my air my patients because i have a relationship with them already buy it now we have all the same when your personal traits and then challenges and.
You know concerns that make my future patients will have,
when they get no kind of not necessarily that they’ll become your clients just like you said but when you see those concerns and those things come up in a social situation for some of these young people,
it allows you to then speak through your website for your blog three to your clients in a way that.
You’ll get them and i think that’s such a great idea of taking care of your business avatar mixing it with things that you like.

[26:43] Exactly what you had and a chest story you’re saying every couple of its so recently i have been trying to help my one year old my four-year old start to learn chest of my two years my four-year old leave.
We played where all playlist by the real rules and then she can pick up a piece and move him anywhere,
and then i had and then i have to figure out what i would do in that situation so it’s good for me but it’s good for her but then slowly will and the coupons before one and then you can before two and the first one and then,
that you ask that would this one do and then slowly she’s learning the pieces and then when you’re all be just can i play with the pieces,
but for a long time like my friends like in high school and college we play we play chess quite a bit and,
there is this one gathering at my apartment in college and,
it was it was just funny situation and so my two friends neck and tied they’re gonna play chess like in the middle of this party and they’re gonna pretend to get a fight over chaska just it will be home is on the left front door and like,
you flip it over to get really mad will somehow like everybody found out that this was gonna happen except for one.
So we are in the waiting for this like fake fight to break out over the chess tournament like acting normal and then take it happens.
And then this guy finds out that like everyone at this party knew about it except for him and he was so mad and he punched a hole in the wall in the rain now and it was just like,
over this random chats joke that we didn’t mean to like help alienate him but it was just because of this ridiculous chasse party.

[28:19] Drinking thing and yeah i was entertaining the color is saying it’s funny you feel it’s,
scanner is turning but we’re talking about cells.

[28:37] You know when things that i’ve been able to do this past year it’s kind of embrace that embrace ahead thirty wasn’t so proud of you i,
yeah i think there’s a lot of women in chest like there’s a lot of strategy and,
if you think you if you like other games like my wife and i like settlers of catan and other games that are like just fun to play were not dungeons and dragons folks.
Not that far a lot so there is showing me like we really enjoyed the strategy games where you have to use your mind more and i think that carries over into business and so many ways are you just developing muscles and your brain.

[29:15] Do you ever incorporate chess or games intercessions yes how do.
No i will work with kids and how.
You know i’m saying with practice in the mail my office up in a gray in that you know.
So many different ways to express yourself whether it’s painting or whether it’s.
Claire whether its toys are when there is chasing or whether its box you know kids.

[29:54] Is this true and when your ex sort of expecting to do your part of therapy.

[30:04] That’s not always to the best way that they have to express themselves and having a lot of,
blonde conditions supervised or that i’m in man work with you to play therapy is something that is kind of.
Scary horse or something like i with i could never do that buys i think it into play therapy and,
in tuck they’re being in terms of the way and i see mr essentially the same dishes differ from those of expression so if the way you interact with somebody bass is through a game or like chain is.
Tester you can win so much about a person in terms of you know how cautious they are or how impulse and they are by the losing making if you are using that as.
Relation ship and i’m relating i think is is to be a huge.
Benefits and in your practice totally agree also just like lack of eye contact like for especially teenagers like to see stare at someone in pockets it’s kind of intense when most of their conversations are over taxed or,
snapchat or whatever.
And so to like not have to look at the person and you know have a conversation but i’m look at the chess pieces and it’s okay to not look at you and i feel like it takes a lot of the pressure off and i’ve seen that it’s just like.

[31:37] They just can become real selves rather than out protective lang i don’t wanna talk teenager cells.

[31:43] Yeah why won’t switch gears on to make sure we have enough time to talk was landing cuz that’s like that’s one of the big things that you offer for therapists and you’re really good at two tom aware therapists go wrong with their branding.
Yeah it’s so,
one of the things that i have been doing in addition to my main practice is,
sorry pennsylvania and design work for further as well that’s in building the building was or you know,
during some consulting on webster and web design and i think there’s a there’s a couple of things,
number one that’s the type is one side over the news checking the menu in terms of.
Will you go out there so that things like finance um fines or are huge ass in the gym revenues in world affairs and there so many bad ones out there anything fun.
You know you and the spacing yeah find you can make something work so much better just by a you know reducing that the space between letters buy it.

[33:03] Ensures really great thing for people to know is if you go and do,
search for friends are so much out there that you can find six and you can find things that are,
you know whether you are or stylus more playful are more modern or were you know in a traditional unsophisticated you can find something that’s really going to express that to your terms either of our websites that you like,
because i know there some there kinda like spammy like and you go to wash or lotion and is on and i like what it’s like your favorite,
find websites that are legit so that’s as a teacher in for a lot of free ones that’s weird and and up with the,
tune into ones that i really live r and b dance beth today and see if its run by adobe to and it’s.
Ceramic painting charging for people who do design and web stuff to you know.
After work it’s like facebook for a for designed you design something will you like and you put it out there and people can comment on it but you but a lot of people will play the oldest,
design and find and the doctor for free and then you can go because it’s as gino just the you talk about alive.
Its way too you know do something to somebody and then have them come and check out your website and see what you do in return and the other one is creative market.

[34:46] Ah this is when the you’re probably going to spend some money on usually it’s not that expensive maybe like fifteen dollars for a five hundred something that you really love and,
you know a friend who you are i think that was well worth it and it also has a lot of different.
You know stuff is there a better actually interesting inside and most funniest thing but.
It is in your textbook for doctor’s office and no difference.
You know big fat or vector files that you can actually use to create your own of those or things scratches for your work place,
to think colors that seems like a really basic thing that i see people on their websites and granting of their business cards and it’s like,
yo i feel like the circuits or yeah there’s no color at all like talk a little bit about colors and maybe colors you feel like i can it in right now and colors they’re definitely out right now with your and maybe is it the area of expertise but.
I’m guessing it right so that i mean there’s,
office of information i moved in and say hola of color and how certain colors may first to make you feel definitely don’t have time to get into that now but i think in terms of.
You’re going to inch just pay three dollars in a in neutral color bike for grey or blue or something along those lines and the accent color.

[36:29] Something really hot and then threw a lighter color that i’m.

[36:36] No rashes but with that neutral color so you have served your base colors the you’re going to use for your backgrounds or.
Your urine test and then you have that is a whore that’s really what he won something to stand out whether that’s a.

[36:56] Oh to buy or you’ll yeah,
four years or something like that and some people who really it’s and noticed i nana really stands out for them,
you know for me i am i like a lot of agrees and if you go to set some of my websites to a lot of a lot of them are in black and white because.
You know i feel like dancing virginia for for both kind of project themselves into.
God damn space on your iphone when you add.
I know that you have your other modalities even your websites are gonna reflect that that’s great news that.

[37:45] Cool so it’s no i think things that you like things that attract you most likely or,
going to attract you or your idea why it’s because in a lot of ways the people that we most one to work with our.

[38:05] People said that we really should because the and in what ways to get there like us there isn’t their strong about apple id and that the people get into this job because they are,
trying to fix themselves and i think it a lot of the times that is true but in a way that is as,
you’re sad and creepy jesus works itself clans nothing creepy about that,
well yeah that’s so true cuz like when we did our website update a little over a year ago we really intentionally went from having kind of,
sad pictures of like you know for old time of depression like someone that’s got their head and hands if you like what was the outcome of counseling okay and happier am hanging out but then we wanted like.
Not just like people walking on the beach holding hands but do have canon instagram looking so it got kind of that yellowish look and mentalwellnesscounseling.com so that it has that instagram feel because it,
but that’s just now looked at many counselors at least in our area shoot for.

[39:11] And second of all you that’s when people looking for when there when they’re looking for you are looking for a female.
How old to go yeah it’s amazing how an even a photo that like i am looking right now and,
and is dad with his like daughter on his shoulders and like if they didn’t have a filter over it looks super cheesy,
what is a girl like using your hands to make a heart shit,
like the sun is coming over her head so she looks like she’s in a field that nice backlight but there’s a filter over the next look not cheesy so even cheesy photos like you know of a good film can make it just looks really great.
Yeah so i am assuming the,
tools out there that you can do that now it is swelling we talked before hand a little bit about can vine you’ve got an awesome giveaway they wanna talk about but tell me a little bit about how those people can use can but help enhancement their branding.
Yes is kind of.
Where am i started with this is such a great school and you know the number one instance,
thanks for the base is free and you can do whatever you want whether that’s you know building your resume or,
letterhead or do anything with social media graphics and.
There’s so much that’s animal re set up for you so if you don’t have the time or you can i don’t have the design skills to to really keep increase something on your own.

[40:49] Can you just pick this.
Text her that is really good to me i can put with this picture and i’m.
Oh that’s perfect but it also gives you the opportunity to,
to do what everyone an idiot really interesting thing is that they just came out with chamber for business is its like nine dollars a month,
buy a lets you upload was use that like you were bread and.
Starts and you’re is and all of us all of that is there just like chilling.
Where is the house and you just really easily goes into.
In two different things or kind of house so you know how to set social media graphic.
Design were huge switch out the door switch out the picture and just don’t,
yeah cuz now you have to do if you if you have the free version is gonna make a facebook social media card,
and then if you wanna make one that’s the same or optimize for twitter us to start over,
there’s no way to just change it to twitter post i still have i still do the free version but it takes a little bit more time to like if i’m gonna make two different things on for it right.

[42:21] Cool so if every counselor in the world were listening right now wilfred what would you want them to know.

[42:32] Let’s see i should of thought about this year in your mass is twenty one flashing and it is asking me but i was like in high am i think that.

[42:47] You know that the people who are.
Most effective in terms of things like marketing and even in terms of for the people that recognize that.
Was there practice their work is.

[43:04] I am an extension of themselves and so anything you do whether that’s your spilling your officer in the building a website to make that,
an expression of who you are because that’s,
what people are going to engage with them that’s where people are going to be looking for gas awesome on so well for you guys and giveaways and on the weekends so it’s about how people can connect with you.
Crazy ass room we were talking about you and you know i’ve seen a lot of people in on facebook and different creams one in there is something that’s always recommended for people to.
Are you sure how to use it so i’m putting together a really easy step by step to.
Wait to you see there any.
A graphic for facebook noon in five simple steps three and pdf you can take care and you have something to put out there in the center fifteen minutes.
Tell me everything would dating one,
so if you need to use psychology design and ice will not ceo and co merges with design website and if you go and.
Start from there in the first step in the first five people i will june with a guy.

[44:36] Bringing valuation for your website engine you can instantly you keep going straight to look at terms of,
is the company doing better or things that you should be doing more that’s awesome how do people get the canvas download from you to.
So we answer and the housing design dot co slash zero.
And will be available for download there are awesome and folks will free is in a genuine awesome guy the five of you to get time with him you’re gonna get real content you’re gonna get real help real branding not just a,
like do this on by my services will forgiveness away to the audience because he is so awesome and just once to demonstrate the skills even more i think it’s so cool to see our guests,
i really valuing this audience ahead and over to psychology design dot co if you want to,
you want to sign up on there then you if you are the first five people you get to connect to floor fred if you’re not and even if you are good for sex go and you can also get those steps for canvas,
on all those links in the show notes wilfred cran thank you so much for taking so much time with us today such awesome content and design a private practice and chances and,
stories so i see carmi chef lee’s brewery there is a pretty amazing place to eat lunch really next time you explain you come.

[46:09] Twenty three c nine zero each,
explode all man’s of them we to six week road trip out west and we’re on our way back we went through st. louis and we went to shaft leads and we set down the middle today this lady was next issues public eighty years old,
he volunteered in their garden and she got a free beer and lunch for volunteering in the garden all like a garden in their to table with is awesome.
That’s pretty sweet well i will talk soon will for think so much for being on the show the union street starting with their.

[46:44] Music.

[47:16] So you can head over the psychology of design dot co that psychology design dot co to replace the.
Well freud and see you get all the giveaways if he’s giving away itself,
also head over to practiceofthepractice.com/webinar to register for that webinar are all about hard starting throw,
time private practice really looking forward to that it’s gonna be just so awesome and that’s gonna be on the seventeenth.
Of february at two o’clock eastern eleven o’clock pacific.
And everything in between so thanks so much for letting me in three years into your brains you guys rock and inspire me every day i get some emails of people doing successful things with a private practice.
And just keep it up keep it up you guys rock to.

[48:04] Music.

[48:24] Silence is sexy and tyler adams public music.

[48:28] Design project in thirteen infection stanley got the subject matter covered his people can’t stand that holds the publisher for the gas surrenders legal accounting clinical and professional information if you want a professional.

[48:40] Music.

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