RISE: Find the Best Clinical Supervision, with Catherine Moore | GP 116

Image of Catherine Moore is captured. On this therapist podcast, Catherine Moore talks about RISE: Find the Best Clinical Supervision

Do you have easy access to great clinical supervision? Where can you connect with a supervisor that is aligned with your values and passion? Would you join a directory of fellow clinical supervisors to improve the quality of therapy?

In this podcast episode, Alison Pidgeon speaks with Catherine Moore about RISE, one of the first clinical supervision directories.

Podcast Sponsor: Brighter Vision

An image of Brighter Vision Web Solutions is featured as the sponsor on Faith in Practice Podcast, a therapist podcast. Brighter Vision builds all in one websites for therapists.

If warmer weather has you feeling like it’s time for a website refresh, or you’d like to boost your online presence, look no further than Brighter Vision’s custom digital marketing solutions, designed specifically for therapists.

And the timing couldn’t be better because they just kicked off their Spring Cleaning sale! Sign up with Brighter Vision before April 30th and you’ll get $10/month off of your first year of website service with the Brighter Vision team, plus they’ll throw in 3 FREE months of Social Genie to give your therapist blog and social media pages a serious boost, so you can focus on what matters most – your patients!

So get a jumpstart on your private practice’s spring cleaning list by contacting Brighter Vision. To get started and learn more, visit brightervision.com/joe.

Meet Catherine Moore

A photo of Catherine Moore is captured. She is a Licensed Clinical Social Worker in Southern California, the host of the Social Workers, Rise podcast, and the directory by the same name. Catherine is featured on the Grow a Group Practice podcast, a podcast for therapists.Catherine Moore is a Licensed Clinical Social Worker in Southern California. Catherine’s mission is to increase the support and connections available for Clinical Supervisors and Social Workers seeking supervision services.

She has over 11 years of practice as a Social Worker in the areas of medical social work, grief, anxiety, and older adult populations. She hosts the Podcast called Social Workers, Rise! and most recently founded the RISE Directory – a national clinical supervisor directory.

Visit Social Workers, Rise! Connect with Catherine on Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn.

In This Podcast

  • Clinical supervision in therapy
  • Expand the network
  • The Social Workers, Rise! podcast

Clinical supervision in therapy

Clinical supervision is the foundation of the work that we do as mental health providers. Social workers are the largest mental health providers in the United States, so [we need] this platform of support for the clinical supervisors of the people who are teaching the next generation. (Catherine Moore)

By investing in high-quality education and supervision for mental health providers, the mental health industry and its capacity, as well as capability, can be revolutionized.

If clinicians are given exemplary supervision and are encouraged to put their best foot forward from the start, they will feel more prepared and ready to serve their communities.

Expand the network

Many clinicians find their supervisors by word of mouth.

Although this strategy works for some people, it can leave many eligible and keen clinicians out of the loop, simply because they do not have the right connections.

That’s limiting. A lot of us don’t have a vast network of clinical supervisors. We’re lucky if we know one person, outside of our boss, that might provide clinical supervision. (Catherine Moore)

By using a clinical supervision directory, the playing fields are leveled out and people are better able to find a supervisor whom they connect well with.

The RISE podcast

Catherine hosts the Social Workers, Rise! podcast that has an array of guests and addresses a plethora of relatable topics.

They talk with corporate social workers, as well as social workers in student affairs, and discuss things like improving your money mindset and starting a side hustle.

The podcast wants to undo toxic narratives that many mental health providers are taught in graduate school.

Useful links mentioned in this episode:

Check out these additional resources:

Meet Alison Pidgeon, Group Practice Owner

An image of Alison Pidgeon is displayed. She is a successful group practice owner and offers private practice consultation for private practice owners to assist in how to grow a group practice. She is the host of Grow A Group Practice Podcast and one of the founders of Group Practice Boss.Alison Pidgeon, LPC is the owner of Move Forward Counseling, a group practice in Lancaster, PA and she runs a virtual assistant company, Move Forward Virtual Assistants.

Alison has been working with Practice of the Practice since 2016.  She has helped over 70 therapist entrepreneurs start and grow their businesses, through mastermind groups and individual consulting.

Transformation From A Private Practice To Group Practice

In addition, she is a private practice consultant for Practice of the Practice. Allison’s private practice ‘grew up.’ What started out as a solo private practice in early 2015 quickly grew into a group practice and has been expanding ever since.

Visit Alison’s website, listen to her podcast, or consult with Alison. Email Alison at alison@practiceofthepractice.com

Thanks For Listening!

Feel free to leave a comment below or share this podcast on social media by clicking on one of the social media links below! Alternatively, leave a review on iTunes and subscribe!

Podcast Transcription

[ALISON PIDGEON] You are listening to the Grow a Group Practice podcast. Whether you were thinking about starting a group practice or in the beginning stages, or want to learn how to scale up your already existing group practice, you are in the right place. I’m Alison Pidgeon, your host, a serial entrepreneur with four businesses, one of which is a large group practice that I started in 2015. Each week, I feature a guest or topic that is relevant to group practice owners. Let’s get started.

Hi, hope you’re having a great day. This is Alison Pidgeon, your host. I love talking to people who take our training and our experience as helping professionals and turns it into something new and helps to make the profession better. That is who I am talking to today. I have an interview with Catherine Moore, who is an LCSW. She is from Southern California and she has worked as a social worker for many years and felt really passionate about folks being able to find good clinical supervisors and for supervisees to get really good clinical supervision and started a directory so that folks can sort of find each other in that realm. So she started something called the RISE directory, which she’s going to talk about. She also has a podcast that’s called Social Workers Rise. Catherine is doing amazing things and it was great to talk with her and hear about the things that she’s creating to help our profession. So here’s my interview with Catherine Moore.
[ALISON] Hi, Catherine. Welcome to the podcast.
[CATHERINE MOORE] Hi Alison. Thank you so much for having me. I’m excited to be here.
[ALISON] Awesome. Let’s start with you introducing yourself.
[CATHERINE] My name’s Catherine Moore. I am an LCSW out of Sunny, Southern California and I have been in the social work field for since 2009, in and out of different areas as far as policy, community organizing, seniors, children. But I really found my home in medical social work and helping people cope and deal with anxiety and changes, grief, and loss, those types of areas for a long time. When I became eligible to provide clinical supervision, I started looking into what does that entail? I wanted to go to one place that just gave me all the tools and resources and training that I need to really feel confident in offering the service and also too how would I market myself after I’m able to provide this service I make this investment in myself. I realized that didn’t exist so I started a venture with the RISE Directory, and I have founded that we started back in 2021. So we’re brand new and it’s a directory for clinical supervisors of social workers. So we’re doing that. Then I’m also the host of the Social Workers Rise podcast while also working at my local hospital as the medical social worker there.
[ALISON] Amazing. I wanted to ask you about the directory. Can you explain to us a little bit how it works?
[CATHERINE] Sure. So it’s a nationwide directory based here in the United States and it is open to clinical supervisors who are eligible to provide clinical supervision in their state or states. Sometimes we’re working in more than one state, so that is perfectly okay. The way that it works is you just log onto the website, you say, join, and then you pick which membership type you would like to join as. You can join us free but that is going to limit you in the amount of information you’re able to share. You’re still able to share your picture, your location and your contact information so people can find you which is a lot better than a lot of the other directories that I’ve seen that are just Excel spreadsheets and don’t really give any information about anybody.

That’s the free, but then you can also sign up for either the monthly or the yearly, which of course has a lot more benefits. You can really get specific on your profile, you have in About me section, we include all sorts of different areas as far as of course your specialty and your niche, what you focus on. Also if you want to include your lived experience, if you want to include your religion, if you want to include your gender identification all of these things are included and then we give you the option to input links. So if you wanted to have people just schedule a time with you right then, and there, you could put in your Calendarly link to your schedule and just make it super easy for people to contact you and to reach out. You could put in your podcast link so people learn more about you. There’s just so many different ways to personalize a profile that, you can tell are really excited about it because I think it’s just very much needed in our field, a more authentic and genuine and easy way for clinical supervisors to be able to be available and for people to be able to find them and connect with them easily.
[ALISON] That was actually going to be one of my questions, like why are you so passionate about this topic that you obviously went to the extent of creating a whole business and directory around it?
[CATHERINE] That’s a very good question. I really believe, well, I know that clinical supervision is the foundation of the work that we do as mental health providers and as social workers are the largest mental health provider in the United States. So by having this platform of support for the clinical supervisors, for the people who are teaching the next generation of mental health providers, how to give quality service, that’s going to, it can completely revolutionize how we approach mental health. I mean, imagine a world where all of the mental health providers are high quality and they really make the change and the impact that we have set out to do. I’d really like to see the shift in the mental health industry, one from going to, oh it’s, I guess it depends on who you ask.

Some people have good experiences some people have bad, but I’ve talked to a lot of people who just felt gypped in their clinical supervision. They didn’t get everything that they needed. It was really hard to learn or connect with the clinical supervisor because maybe they were unavailable or distant or even traumatic. Sometimes I’ve heard some stories that their clinical supervision was harmful psychologically to them. That just breaks my heart, because these are some amazing people who are genuinely showing up and wanting to learn and wanting to provide the best services to their clients.

So they may feel stuck or like they don’t have any choices and I never want people to feel like they don’t have choices. So that’s why I’m so passionate about bringing it out because I want people to know what their options are. If your clinical supervisor doesn’t serve your needs right now, then let’s help you find someone who will. If they’re not in your niche that you’re trying to pursue, maybe that’s not your career goal you want to find someone who’s within your career goals, who’s aligned with where you see yourself in the future because that’s the whole point of clinical supervision. That’s why I’m so passionate about it.
[ALISON] I think that’s great because I think that it’s unfortunate that we have to sort fight to get supervision. Sometimes I remember that in my community mental health position, I was an unlicensed clinician and I wanted to get my two hours a week and I wanted to learn and grow and it’s like, I really had to be very assertive to even get the supervision that I needed to get licensed. So yes, I think that’s great anyway, to make it easier is wonderful.
[CATHERINE] It’s still happening today. People still have to fight to get that clinical supervision, but where do you even go to start the fight? How do you find a clinical supervisor? We did some market research that a lot of people were found via the internet. So new supervisees are doing a Google search and trying to find them and it’s just, it’s so ineffective. Then also too, the second way that people were found was through word of mouth and referrals. That’s limiting a lot of us don’t have a vast network of clinical supervisors. We’re lucky if we know one person outside of our boss that might provide clinical supervision.

So it’s just so limited that there’s a lot of problems with that when this is the foundation of your clinical career and you have two people to choose from as your mentors or the people that’s going to guide you. That’s why I’m just really excited to bring this to flourishion because once you’re, if someone’s doing a Google search, we’re going to pop up. Then they can search for you based on your location or your state where you’re at. Because right now state laws, we got to, it’s state specific. So I’m excited for the day that we can be national and we can practice therapy in all 50 states, but until then —
[ALISON] Me too. So you got this idea to create this directory and then how did you actually go about creating it? Did you hire a website company or what was your next step?
[CATHERINE] I had no idea what I was going to do at first. I tried to do it on my own with because I have my own website for the podcast and my courses. I was thinking maybe I could just add onto that, but no, this is no easy task. That’s what I realized, oh my gosh, this is going to be such a beast. So I did have a website developer and marketer specifically create and build the site, which took a really long time. We’re still building, we’re still improving. I don’t think that’s ever going to stop. It’s just the way of the business. You always have to be improving and fixing things and adding things, taking things away. So it keeps us on our toes for sure.
[ALISON] When you rolled out the website, what were people’s initial reactions to it
[CATHERINE] Excited, but not in a hurry to join as a member which I was really kind disappointed if I’ll be honest because everyone I spoke to was really excited about and said, yes, this is so needed. This is great. This is amazing. Oh my gosh, sign me up for the email list. Then when we launched, it was like crickets. Where did everyone go?
[ALISON] I think for something that’s a relatively new concept, it just takes time. I think eventually it’ll just become commonplace like, well of course there’s the directory to find a supervisor?
[CATHERINE] Exactly. That’s really our main goal, is not just to be a directory, but to really offer all the support that clinical supervisors need. So we’re currently offering workshops and trainings and clinical consultation support groups. We have just all of these plans to build out more, because we really want to be the go to resource for clinical supervision so that what I was looking for in the back then or now is just everything in one place, all the tools that you need and just continue to grow out that library of resources.
[ALISON] That sounds amazing. It’s so cool how you can take one initial idea and then you start to see all these ways that you can like continue to expand on it and provide even more services or value to people.
[CATHERINE] Exactly. Yes because I mean, I would love to go to a conference for clinical supervisors. I think that would be amazing
[BRIGHTER VISION] If warmer weather has you feeling like it’s time for a website refresh or you’d like to boost your online presence, look no further than Brighter Vision’s custom digital marketing solutions designed specifically for therapists. The timing Couldn’t be better because they just kicked off their spring-cleaning sale. Sign up with Brighter Vision before April 30th, and you’ll get $10 a month off your first year of website services with the Brighter Vision team. Plus, they’ll throw in three, free months of Social Genie to give your therapist blog and social media pages a serious boost, so you can focus on what matters most your patients. Get a jump start on your private practice spring cleaning list by contacting Brighter Vision. To get started and learn more, go to brightervision.com/joe. One more time, that’s brightervision.com/joe.
[ALISON] Well, that’s next year’s plan, right, Catherine.
[CATHERINE] I don’t know, not next year, but maybe the five-year plan.
[ALISON] Yes, the five-year plan. So let’s switch gears a little bit and tell us about your podcast. What is it about? I know you interview some folks on there. Who are the types of guests that you have and how’d you get started?
[CATHERINE] The podcast is called Social Workers Rise and this was started in January, 2020. I had no idea what was, of course what was about to ensue that year, but I really started it because honestly, I was about to quit social work. I was about to, considering just leaving the field of mental health altogether. I was just feeling so deflated, so burnt out, so overworked and underappreciated and I recognized all of these toxic narratives that we have within our field and I considered leaving. But at the end of the day, I am a social worker, through and through and there’s not really any other industry or any other work that I would want to do. I just have such a passion for other social workers, because I think that social workers and mental health professionals in general are such amazing people. They are kind and empathetic and they really truly want to help people. That’s a beautiful thing in this world. We don’t see it very often.

So I really wanted to find a way to change these toxic narratives that we have. So things like you’re not going to make money as a social worker. Things like you should just expect to be burnt out and be okay with that. Those are really the two main things that get me going, but, so I wanted to just shine the light on people who are doing amazing work. Over the past two years, what it’s really evolved into is what are all the ways that we can use our mental health skills in different industries and get creative with it, figure out how to solve problems in new ways? We are never stuck. We need to take precautions to not be burnt out, to really have those boundaries for our mental wellness, because it’s part of our professionalism.

It’s a learned skill that we need to have to be able to understand how we’re doing, how we’re feeling, be honest with ourselves and really take those steps that we need to make sure that we’re operating at a hundred percent, that we’re not burnt out, that we are really showing up genuinely and authentically as much as we possibly can. I know it’s easier said than done, but yes, so those are the conversations we have. I love talking with mental health professionals who are in non-traditional fields. So we’ve talked with, recently we talked with a corporate social worker. We talked with someone in student affairs. We’ve talked about money mindsets, how to start a side hustle, so a lot of topics that you have not heard about in grad school, but that people really, really need that are going to be real authentic and just applicable to the field and the work that we do.
[ALISON] That’s awesome. I love that you talked about how the podcast really is too, kind of, I don’t know what the word I’m trying to think of is, but like undo those toxic narratives that we’ve all heard starting very early on, right in graduate school. Like you’re never going to make any money doing this. You’re just going to be a martyr. I think that’s something I’ve had to work on myself, like going into private practice and then also I see it in my staff, the therapists that work for me. It’s actually really, really sad that one of my big goals is to treat the staff really well. So when I do treat them well, they almost like can’t believe it or think it’s not like any big deal. It’s like oh, here’s a birthday card. You know what I mean? Like it’s not anything like so fantastic that somebody would be super impressed, but I feel like, because we just, in general don’t get treated that well, like in a workplace environment that like you show them like the smallest bit of kindness and they’re like, oh my gosh, it’s so wonderful to work here.
[CATHERINE] Yes. It’s so true. You’re right. That is so sad that that you’re, that there’s such a industrywide problem of people not feeling appreciated, not feeling seen because that’s all we do all day, is appreciate other people. I know what you mean when you’ve been in an environment where you’re not feeling appreciated, you’re feeling like why don’t you just shut up and do your work? You’re feeling like your talents really aren’t being utilized when you make the transition into a supportive environment where people point out your strengths and give you positive feedback and see you like, hey, it’s your birthday? Let’s honor. You let’s celebrate you. Oh my gosh. It makes such a difference.
[ALISON] Yes, for sure. So I think it’s cool that you’re working to undo all of those things because I think we need to, because people aren’t going to stay in the profession if they’re burned out and barely making ends meet.
[CATHERINE] Right. I’d like to see some, some recent new statistics on burnout because before it would, it was that we would burn out after about three years in the field. I would venture to guess it’s much, much faster now, maybe even —
[ALISON] Because of the pandemic, do you think?
[CATHERINE] Yes, maybe even six months to a year, because I’ve talked to so many grad students in the past year that are already feeling burnt out and it’s probably just, they were probably operating in survival mode in grad school. Now once they’re in the field, it’s just can’t do it anymore. It’s just too much. Those new jobs that we have as new grads, man, they’re tough. They’re really tough.
[ALISON] Yes. So hopefully you and I can start to change the industry a little bit so that people don’t get burned out and they want to stay.
[CATHERINE] Yes, I think it’s already happening. I can see the shift. I’ve been connecting with so many other people like you and I who are changing the narratives and a podcast is such a powerful way to do that because it’s real, it’s authentic, it’s uncensored. It’s the real conversations that are happening in the field currently right now. So I think it’s really amazing that you have this podcast and you’ve been doing it for so long for the past two years. So major props for you.
[ALISON] Thank you. Thanks. Switching gears again a little bit, what do you think about the future of the social work field? What do you think it’s going to evolve into potentially?
[CATHERINE] That’s a good question.
[ALISON] What do you hope it evolves into?
[CATHERINE] That’s huge. I feel like it’s like, oh, college course.
[ALISON] We could talk about that all day.
[CATHERINE] Well, for one, what I’ve noticed is that, of course over the past two years there’s been an increased awareness of the colonialism of social work or decolonizing social work and having more awareness of how we present ourselves and the microaggressions, the trauma. Being trauma-informed is a huge topic right now and also too, just being overall healthy and well and living a balanced life. So my hope, at least for the mental health and social work industry is that we really set the standards for self-care, for wellness, what it means to feel balanced and to be able to show up authentically because the work that we do is so emotionally heavy and draining that it takes its physical toll on us. Just because there’s eight hours in the workday doesn’t mean that we can do therapy for eight hours. I mean, maybe someone can, but I know I, for sure, can’t. It’s just too emotionally taxing and to really take a stand and advocate for ourselves. One way, your private practice, that’s amazing to be in that space and to really create the businesses that we wish we had and be able to just know that we were showing up the best that we can. Some days that might look different than other days. So I guess the short answer to your question is I hope that we can just be more well, more aware of how we’re showing up and create less harm.
[ALISON] So how do you balance having your full-time job and then also having the podcast and you have this new business of the directory? How do you balance all of that?
[CATHERINE] It’s a challenge. Every day, it’s something that I consciously think about like how am I going to be spending my time and my energy today. The thing that I’ve found that helps me the most is really just good old-fashioned mindfulness, checking in with myself, seeing how I’m feeling, seeing how my body is and noticing trends. So recently I’ve noticed I’ve just been in a funk lately for no good reason, really, but I just felt like just not as energetic or happy or fun as I normally would like to feel. So I’ve been researching different hobbies. So I signed up for a dance class, we went skating the other day. So just trying to find little ways that I could integrate more fun into my life, I think goes a long way and then taking that opportunity too, to have fun with my family and loved ones. I’m very grateful that now we’ve opened back up after the pandemic and it makes it a lot easier to try to integrate that balance and fun, but it’s definitely an everyday thought that I have in my mind.
[ALISON] It’s always a work in progress.
[CATHERINE] I’m curious how you do it with staff and having your own private practice and how do you stay balanced and stay well.
[ALISON] I always tell people that I just delegate a lot. Like I have no problem giving tasks away to other people and I have operations people who really run the day-to-day tasks of the business. That helps me just to focus on the big picture and obviously freeze up some of my time. That’s how I do it.
[CATHERINE] Awesome. Definitely worth the investment.
[ALISON] Yes, you have to have great staff to make that all work.
[CATHERINE] Yes, for sure.
[ALISON] Yep. Well, Catherine has been so great talking with you. Can you tell us how folks can check out your podcast and the directory and all that good stuff?
[CATHERINE] So the podcast is Social Workers Rise and we are on Instagram at Social Workers Rise. As far as the directory, we are open for business and ready for sign up. So that’s risedirectory.com and we are on Instagram and LinkedIn at RISE Directory.
[ALISON] Excellent. Well, thank you so much, Catherine. It’s so great to hear about all the things that you’re doing and the way you’re positively lifting up the social work community. So thank you.
[CATHERINE] Thank you so much for having me, Alison. This was fun.
[ALISON] Once again, I want to say thank you to Brighter Vision for being a sponsor of this podcast. They are having a spring-cleaning sale right now. If you’re interested in learning more, go to brightervision.com/joe.

Thanks so much for listening today. Definitely check out Catherine’s directory. I think it’s amazing what she’s doing for our profession. I will talk to you all next time.

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This podcast is designed to provide accurate and authoritative information in regards to the subject matter covered. This is given with the understanding that neither the host, Practice of the Practice, or the guests are providing legal, mental health, or other professional information. If you need a professional, you should find one.

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